| Archive for JACKS SHED. the REAL countryside and REAL country folk. |
| fishy1 |
Lead launcher?Does anyone have any ideas on how to get a set line pluis weight out 100-200 yards in the sea without a boat? I thought you might be able to cast out normally with a regular lead, then attach the longline and let it slide down the line, but this seems hit and miss. Kite fishing or a mini sailboat were ideas I had, but you need wind. Could a tube be made powered by catapult elastic, rather like a speargun and the lead launched from that? To get the required power, you'd need lots of bands, so maybe you could charge it one band at a time? I'd imagine this thing would be pretty strong. How would you recommend ensuring the longline doesn't get caught? For something small, I'd just hold it in my hands, but for 50 hooks, this isn't an option.Many thanks guys. |
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| Gareth |
How about a power band powered surface torpedo.
Nothiing special just a capped section of plastic drain pipe. Have the band powering a propeller, just like model aircraft and boats. Use a cordless drill to wind the powerband up. |
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| fishy1 |
Would you be able to wind that up enough to go 200 yards? | ||
| fish |
back in the late 1980's a chap in dorset designed and used a morter type gun to shoot his cod rigs and an 8oz lead over 300 yards out to sea! worked a treat and made the angling press,till he was had by the police as it yechnically was a firearm,so they had him for no liscence and discharging in a public place and within 20 yds of a highway! 
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| fishy1 |
Yes, that is what steered me away from mortar type devices, and also pneumatic power. The terrifying thought of the pipe exploding with asociated shrapnel also put me off. | ||
| Barapoi |
I think he must have done a search of the 'net and found out about Spud guns. ( the Adult version )
Nooo, not the ones you had as a young lad, stuck the barrel into a spud then squeeze, but the ones who's barrels are about 4-6 ft long, up to about 2" dia, powered by "engine start" (ether) and ignited by a BBQ spark igniter Typically they are made of high pressure plastic water pipe and fittings- not easy to get hold of. They are also classed as a fire-arm in NZ also. Barapoi AKA " Stuey the Kiwi" |
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| Tidal_wear |
Stuey,dont they use a version of a power-kite to fish for sharks in NZ?To get the bait right offshore? | ||
| pablo |
only the other month in one of the fishing mags i seen a romote control boat for launcing bait dosent your old man fish do remote control models just an idea | ||
| Tidal_wear |
Years ago my mate had an old carp bait-boat pablo,we experimented with one as a means of running a net out,but it didnt have the capacity to take more that 10-15 yards of net out,and I can throw that much out so it was back to the drawing-board
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| steve |
i once see a bloke cast a small grappling hook to retrive lost fishing leads in the sea and he was getting out about 100 yards, and all it was is a long wooden pole the grappling hook cliped on a round link and hooked on the end of a nail at the top of the pole cast out over head and the thin rope coiled on the beach i was amazed how easy he made it look. | ||
| pablo |
dummy launcher | ||
| Barapoi |
Hmmmm,
It looks like we do things a bit different down here in Godzone. What is classed as a "set-line" in the UK? How many hooks are you allowed to have on your line? here in NZ the max is 25, wether it is dropped by boat or a kite or Kontiki is used to get it out from a beach. When I first started fishing here, I was "surfcasting" off the west coast beaches of Auckland. I used a Penn 15ft surfcasting rod and it could easily sling a 4oz sinker with a 3 or 4 hook flasher rig 120 metres offshore( and I'm no expert caster). Fishing Kites and the old style Kontikis need an offshore wind, but the new Kontikis (aka "fishing torpedos") don't, but they can be expensive. A good NZ site is www.fishingkites.co.nz - have a look, Paul has both kites(his speciality) and electric torpedoes. Don't have a fit when you see the prices, the NZ dollar is worth about 35p at the moment! For those of you who are mechanically minded, it may get the inventive juices flowing, a mate of mine knocked up an electric torpedoe in couple weekends using a very cheap and nasty cordless drill as the motor, a lenght of plastic downpipe, motorcycle battery and the prop was the fan from a PC's power supply cooling fan! - His biggest cost was the 800metres of 100lb breaking strain nylon and he even got a deal on that! All up it would have cost him about 30 quid in materials and 2 weekends quiet time in the shed away from the Missus and rug-rats. The bdooly thing only took about 3mins to get about 100m offshore in calm water! Tidal - nobody goes targetting sharks in NZ - they are a by-catch, there are much better fish in our seas, see the above website ( I have caught a 21Kg/46lb school shark on 6Kg line, which got me heaviest non-scale fish in a national fishing comp - but that's another story to be told) Regards Barapoi |
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| Tidal_wear |
Yeah,I remembered the article now Stuey,it was a brit guy who used to shark fish,he started importing the kites into the UK and selling them in various angling periodicals "Sea Angler" did an article on him,the kites never took off(no pun intended) over here for some reason,wonder if those torpedoes could tow a new 
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| fishy1 |
A setline is basically a line that is anchored at both ends with hooks hanging off snoods. There is no restrictions on the no of hooks, so I could run 300 hooks no bother. You can cast out a few baits with a rod, but lots are very difficult. The difficulty with electric torpedos is that they are classed as motorised, so licenses and stuff need to be bought, and it becomes uneconomical. Plus, then you have quotas and regulations galore. Did your friend have anything to cut out the motor when it got out the full distance? It seems an interesting idea to build one. Perhaps a mini one could be build and used similar to an otter board for trout. I have a few electric motors and stuff lying about, will try it perhaps. Hmm, now I think about it, I could use one for the mackerel. |
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| Barapoi |
300 Hooks?
bdooly hell! -I'd be classed as a commercial fisherman, I'd need licences, fishing quota allowances etc, etc and big brother Ministry of Fisheries looking over my shoulder all the time making sure I'd crossed the T's and dotted the i's on all my paper work! As a recreational sea fisher I don't need a licence of any sort, BUT there are rules on minimum sizes and bag limits which vary, depending on species. You don't need a licence for an electric torpedo, so long as you adhere to the 25 hook maximum for all set-lines. I regularly fish the Kiapara Harbour, which is the largest harbour in the southern hemisphere ( about 2500Km's of coastline ). It has a variety of fish - Scnapper, Gurnard, Kahawai and lots of bdooly sharks! The only shark worth keeping is the spotted dogfish, aka Rig or "lemon fish"the rest we just throw back. The tidal flow can be so strong that we have to use 32oz sinkers to get to the bottom where the fish are. I would love to hear about your fishing methods up there and I can see I'll have to take my camera out with me fishing more often and post some pic's here. Regards Barapoi PS You do need a licence for trout or salmon fishing only here. |
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| fishy1 |
When I said licenses, I was refering to over here.
We don't need licenses of any kind to rod fish for salmon or trout, but you do need to get a permit in most cases. In the sea, pretty much all methods can be used except poisons and monofiliament gill nets, of course their are certain regulations about meshes and stuff. We have minimum sizes as well over here, which is fair enough. No bag limits though. I would probably be classed as using a motorised vessel with a torpedo, so then you do need to buy licenses etc for selling fish, and it's prohibative. I am wondering now if I could build a solar powered torpedo to get around this though, will have to ask the fisheries office. For non motorised vessels under 10m, or from the shore etc, you need no licenses so it's a good oppertunity for some money. With the longlines, the no of hooks is not restricted. |
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| fossil |
when i lived in NZ i used to fish around north head in devonport and narrow neck beach just up the road, i used to love catching the kawai (i think thats how you spell it !) such good fighting fish and on xmas day we were camping up at cape reinga and i caught a 12lb trevelly on 10lb line and a 9 foot rod, a bum twitching experince i can tell you !! made a good xmas day meal though !! | ||
| Barapoi |
Fossil,
Did you ever try fishing for John Dory off the Devenport wharf? BTW it's spelt "Kahawai", and yes they are a magic fighting fish, great sport on light line, my best to date being 2.8Kg on 6Kg line. Cunning sods too - if your'e on a boat of 12 fishos and a school of them comes past and every body starts hooking up it's bdooly mayhem!, youv'e got lines going in every which way as they make there runs and everyone ends up in a great tangle. The American anglers love them and spend a great deal of $$'s to saltwater fly fish for them down here. Sadly up until recently the Kahawai fishery stocks in the Hauraki Gulf have been sadly depleted by large trawlers, the catch being exported to Aussie and sold as crayfish-pot bait @ about NZD$3.00 a kilo! Now that a bunch of national fishing clubs, bodies have taken a High Court case against the Minister of Fisheries and his department, it seems there is light at the end of the tunnel and the fish are returning to the outer gulf. The picture I am posting was taken on a truely calm day, about 1Km off the NW coast of Little Barrier Island, there was not a breath of wind the sea was like a mirror, then of a sudden we heard a dull roar, looked up and there was a "work-up" of Kahawai on the surface chasing a feed! The skipper of the charter boat we were on said he had not seen the like for at least the last 4 years. the school was at least the area of two rugby pitches end to end, and got to about 25m off the stern. 
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| fish |
"We don't need licenses of any kind to rod fish for salmon or trout, but you do need to get a permit in most cases. "
where the f are you then fishy1!!?? in the uk we need a game rod liscence for almon trout and sea trout! i need to find out more about these fishing torpedoes! |
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| Tidal_wear |
Game rod licences are optional,caught thousands of salmon and trout without one
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| fish |
just read the writ up on them! wow want one!
http://www.fishingkites.co.nz/electrickontiki/electric_kontikis.html |
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| Tidal_wear |
We all want new toys 
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| fish |
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| Gareth |
Alright then. Let's talk about what you want from a long lining torpedeo.
How long a longline would you want it to deliver? Hook dropper spacings. Hook dropper lengths. Hook size. Potential baits. Do you want it to drop the line, and then be able to recover the torpedeo, and so use it to deliver another longline? Or: Do you want to use the torpedeo as a large float, supporting the lines? Tell me what you want, and I'll do a Blue Peter. |
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| fishy1 |
In england and wales you may need a game rod license, but in scotland we do not. "Alright then. Let's talk about what you want from a long lining torpedeo. How long a longline would you want it to deliver?" - Up to 1km at most. "Hook dropper spacings." Variable, anything from close together for mackerel etc, to maybe 10m. "Hook dropper lengths." Again variable, maybe 2m at max. "Hook size." Probably nothing bigger than 6/0 "Potential baits." Sandeels, mackerel, feathers possibly, "Do you want it to drop the line, and then be able to recover the torpedeo, and so use it to deliver another longline?" Now, that is an interesting idea. The only way I could think of doing this would be either to attach two lines to the torpedo, and release one and then just pull it back in, although this would probably tangle, or to have the torpedo remote controlled, which would be expensive. Finding it when it hit the shore would also be difficult unless you had a tracking device I guess. "Or: Do you want to use the torpedeo as a large float, supporting the lines?" This was my original thought. "Tell me what you want, and I'll do a Blue Peter." |
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| Tidal_wear |
This should be interesting
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| Gareth |
Now I'm gonna tell you what can do for a maximum budget of £50
I can make a torpedeo that will; go out to between 300 and 400 metres, and drop a longline wiith 20 baited, 2 metre long paternoster droppers with 3/0 hooks baited with sandeel, Smelts, Joeys, peelers, feathers or worm baits. The key word is DROP, and not Tow. Towing baits is going to need a lot more torpedeo drive energy than dropping them. Basically the torpedeo is fixed to the shore using a large diametre circular hand line, or better still one of those large secondhand Australian Alvey seafishing reels (you can pick these up for less than a tenner.... .... .... I know cuz I've got two of em!), or a suitably sized secondhand large capacity multiplying reel. The long line is also fixed to the shore by the same means. The trick is not to tow the line out off the shore based reels, but to drop it from two fixed spool reel spools on the back of the torpedeo. at a predetermined distance the line on the long line spool runs out and drops a 6 oz grip weight overboard, everything else on this line is now the business end of the long line. At every dropper (paternoster link) knot is a 1 oz Wye weight. say 20 droppers, 2 metres long, every 5 metres. If you like every 4th or 5th bait can be popped up wth a small polyball. That way you have baits on the bottom, and popped baits for cruising fish. The torpedeo reaches the end on the long line, and another 6 oz gripper weght goes overboard. This now leaves an empty torpedeo that can be recovered with the shore based reel, recharged, reset, and sent out again with another long line. The longlines can be left out for as long as you like and recovered at will So, if you want 200-300 baited droppers delivered to 1000 metres go spend £500+ on one of those Kiwi thingies |
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| Tidal_wear |
Well guys money-where-your-mouth-is time,anyone interested in one should stump up fifty quid,if I lived near I beach I would sure as hell be delving into my pockets Keep this thread going and see how it turns out
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| Gareth |
Hehehehehe.
Had a 200 metre trial run on Whittlingham Broad this afternoon. |
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| Tidal_wear |
I wonder how many mackerel feathers you could take out with one?Those alveys are ugly looking reals,got a few for nowt years ago,used to be good for wrecking though
How did the trial go? 
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| fish |
wouldnt a carp fishing bait boat do the job? | ||
| Tidal_wear |
Nope,tried one years back fish old bean,couldnt get any length of net on it whatsoever,few yards at the most,it didnt have the capacity
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| fishy1 |
Gareth, that sounds great, but how do you avoid tangles when getting the longline off the reel? | ||
| Gareth |
That's the trick.......................
The line is not peeling from the shore based reels. The line is stripping from the two fixed spool reel spools that I have fitted to the torpedeo itself. The torpedeo recovery line i have used is 15lb B.S. mono treated with silicone floatant. The Longline is 50lb B.S. sea fishing mono, that sinks. The long line passes through a ledger run ring that has been glued to a small round fridge magnet, that sits on a small piece of steel at the rear of the torpedeo. When the first longline weight hits the ring, it falls off the steel, and goes down with the weight. One of the design errors so far highlighted is the ring for the torpedeo recovery line. This is a steel screw in type, and needs to be the magnetic type also. Then the recovery line can run down the side of the torpedeo to a fixed ring at the prow. Bringing her back in stern first was not the most efficent way, with the damn thing tracking all over the place |
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| fishy1 |
I understand the line is fed out from two reels on the torpedo. What I don't understand is how you get the longline, with hooks and weights attached, off the reel and into the water. I'm not exactly sure what a run ring is, is it basically just a swivel that's free to move up the line? And if the run ring falls off the torpedo at the 1st weight, surely you'd need as many run rings as their are hooks? |
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| Gareth |
No!
I am not using reels on the torpedeo. Just the detachable spools from two fixed spool reels. the longlines shore/recovery line is wound onto the spools, but not the the dropper line. The spools have a tag left, which is atttached to the dropped line. the spools are just temporary storage devices. The line is not tied to the spool, as you would when using the reel on a rod. |
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| fishy1 |
Sorry, I should have said spool.
But I still don't understand, where does the dropper line go if not on the spool? Thanks for your help, I will understand it eventually I'm sure. |
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| Gareth |
I'll do a schematic layout sketch of how it works and post it tomorrow.
Note: I said schematic..... ..... ...... ..... Not proper technical drawings or photos just yet ...... ..... .... ...... it's still a secret. |
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| Gareth |
My rubber band powered torpedeo took 200 metres of line out across whittlingham broad this afternoon. At 150 metres out, it started dropping the weighted secton of the longline (with qty 5 off), 1/2 oz Wye weights at 10 metre intervals. It's got a slight tracking problem at the moment though, as goes off a fair bit to one side, especially when reeling it in. I need to be able to swing the torpedeo around, and bring it in bow first rather than stern first. Then the F'kin broads authority launch appeared and wanted to know what I was up to............................... Hehehehe I'd already dropped the test longline, albeit without any dropper paternoster links and hooks |
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| Tidal_wear |
Should have told them you were undertaking important R&D trials for Thames Valley Fisheries Dept(me)
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| Tidal_wear |
Gareth,are you still undertaking R&D work on that torpedo?Hows it going so far?Sunk anything yet?Figured out the line-laying procedure yet?
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| Splinters |
Thats how they used to cast a hand line when my Grandad was a boy off of a hazel thumb stick! sorry to sound daft but isnt setting it at low water an option? |
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| fish |
yep,thats what i do,set at low water and come back 12 hours or there abouts,later. | ||